In the last few weeks there has been an abundance of posts, articles and think pieces about right-wing alternative media figures and their impact on the American electorate.
Also, I can easily see The American Prospect being the ‘big tent’ anchor magazine of the whole Party in the next few years, since it’s practically already the New Brandeis crowd’s favorite; as for future streaming stars, the more upscale, low-key Party apparatchiks might like imreallyimportant more than either Hasan or Destiny. But yeah, Joe Rogan is unmatched and likely unmatchable in the podcasting world
The online media landscape has become a breeding ground for right wing noise makers since left wing media rarely take risks and always play by the rules. We need to stop sitting on the sidelines while young people get indoctrinated into conservative memes and start creating content that speaks directly to their lived experiences. It's overdue that the left bring fight to the right by building a counter narrative that can actually compete. I'm down with your vision of an unabashedly socialist left taking control of our narrative – we must leverage every tool at our disposal, break down the status quo, be willing to play dirty, push the boundaries of the rules, and pave the way for a more just society.
Just a few loosely related thoughts. I feel like this is more of a criticism on the state of entertainment itself. To that end, no, there's no need for a liberal Joe Rogan (which I think you conclude at one point but maybe un-conclude later on?). Either way, I agree with the conclusion that society doesn't need these influencers or more of them. What it desperately needs are alternative institutions (for lack of a better word), that actually reject the memes, entertainment, gamification and product hawking that has enmeshed itself in politics and life in general. The kids aren't fucking stupid and the vote for Trump is as much laughing with the right as it is laughing at them. And not even because it's that funny but because they have nothing better to do with their votes or with their lives... Republicans probably already sense the limits of their 2024 strategy and are already working on crafting more meaningful, sincere messaging.
Have you considered that young men are not completely fungible and moldable, but have inborn desires that are spoken to by Rogan et al? They enjoy combat sports and gambling not because they have been propagandized, but because young men love winning and taking risks, and they will not be swayed by promises of safety administered thru social democracy.
There's no reason you can't have exciting, competitive, combative communists, socialists or social democrats though.
Fighting as a sport doesn't belong to capitalism. Mohammed Ali and Mike Tyson are both know as the greatest boxers ever and both had anticapitalist ideas.
Not only that, but the Bolsheviks fought a violent revolution to achieve their ends. But leftism as it actually exists now is an effort to extend the logic of the public school or nursing home to the whole of society. Safety and therapy at any cost. Happy to be disproven if you can show me the pro-risk leftist.
I think having a certain amount of security guaranteed by society would be great. I also love risk in my personal life. I see no reason why they are incompatible.
And Im not very clever but I'm pretty sure all of the violent revolutions were thought with peace,freedom and security in mind as part of their ultimate goals. They wanted socialism to ensure nobody had to suffer poverty didn't they?
Re: Destiny, specifically on this point about “what works” vs “moralizing” — one of the issues with divorcing economic models from moral consideration is that it allows you to view consumer satisfaction as the only metric for economic success. Clothing manufacture is actually the perfect example here: it is true that clothing companies efficiently produce lots of options for their consumers, but they happen to do that on the backs of some of the most exploited labor in the world, which is no doubt a part of their success. If your only measure outputs in your calculus for which model works, you end up missing a whole host of problems that — I think — should be unacceptable for those of us concerned with human well being and suffering. Maybe you address this and I just haven’t gotten there yet, but it was bothering me enough to type this.
The thing is the left has a ton of personalities who are big: Hbomberguy, Trueanon, Deprogram, Cumtown, Hasan, Chapo, Friendlyjordies. The problem is they have principles thatd stop them from being DNC mouthpieces in the same way that Rogan could be easily swayed to endorse Trump
I think part of it starts with the need for self-help (also therapy), which is always individual focused. Having just finished reading Naomi Klein's Doppelganger, it's clear to me that a more solidary/collective perspective is increasingly harder to foster.
Wait I thought you were the liberal Joe Rogan
Based and Allende-pilled, may Staffordwave rule the internet for 1000 years
Also, I can easily see The American Prospect being the ‘big tent’ anchor magazine of the whole Party in the next few years, since it’s practically already the New Brandeis crowd’s favorite; as for future streaming stars, the more upscale, low-key Party apparatchiks might like imreallyimportant more than either Hasan or Destiny. But yeah, Joe Rogan is unmatched and likely unmatchable in the podcasting world
The online media landscape has become a breeding ground for right wing noise makers since left wing media rarely take risks and always play by the rules. We need to stop sitting on the sidelines while young people get indoctrinated into conservative memes and start creating content that speaks directly to their lived experiences. It's overdue that the left bring fight to the right by building a counter narrative that can actually compete. I'm down with your vision of an unabashedly socialist left taking control of our narrative – we must leverage every tool at our disposal, break down the status quo, be willing to play dirty, push the boundaries of the rules, and pave the way for a more just society.
Just a few loosely related thoughts. I feel like this is more of a criticism on the state of entertainment itself. To that end, no, there's no need for a liberal Joe Rogan (which I think you conclude at one point but maybe un-conclude later on?). Either way, I agree with the conclusion that society doesn't need these influencers or more of them. What it desperately needs are alternative institutions (for lack of a better word), that actually reject the memes, entertainment, gamification and product hawking that has enmeshed itself in politics and life in general. The kids aren't fucking stupid and the vote for Trump is as much laughing with the right as it is laughing at them. And not even because it's that funny but because they have nothing better to do with their votes or with their lives... Republicans probably already sense the limits of their 2024 strategy and are already working on crafting more meaningful, sincere messaging.
Have you considered that young men are not completely fungible and moldable, but have inborn desires that are spoken to by Rogan et al? They enjoy combat sports and gambling not because they have been propagandized, but because young men love winning and taking risks, and they will not be swayed by promises of safety administered thru social democracy.
There's no reason you can't have exciting, competitive, combative communists, socialists or social democrats though.
Fighting as a sport doesn't belong to capitalism. Mohammed Ali and Mike Tyson are both know as the greatest boxers ever and both had anticapitalist ideas.
Not only that, but the Bolsheviks fought a violent revolution to achieve their ends. But leftism as it actually exists now is an effort to extend the logic of the public school or nursing home to the whole of society. Safety and therapy at any cost. Happy to be disproven if you can show me the pro-risk leftist.
I think having a certain amount of security guaranteed by society would be great. I also love risk in my personal life. I see no reason why they are incompatible.
And Im not very clever but I'm pretty sure all of the violent revolutions were thought with peace,freedom and security in mind as part of their ultimate goals. They wanted socialism to ensure nobody had to suffer poverty didn't they?
Re: Destiny, specifically on this point about “what works” vs “moralizing” — one of the issues with divorcing economic models from moral consideration is that it allows you to view consumer satisfaction as the only metric for economic success. Clothing manufacture is actually the perfect example here: it is true that clothing companies efficiently produce lots of options for their consumers, but they happen to do that on the backs of some of the most exploited labor in the world, which is no doubt a part of their success. If your only measure outputs in your calculus for which model works, you end up missing a whole host of problems that — I think — should be unacceptable for those of us concerned with human well being and suffering. Maybe you address this and I just haven’t gotten there yet, but it was bothering me enough to type this.
Also, Jesus Christ, his shit about the American military order being a positive force in the world is just so myopic
The thing is the left has a ton of personalities who are big: Hbomberguy, Trueanon, Deprogram, Cumtown, Hasan, Chapo, Friendlyjordies. The problem is they have principles thatd stop them from being DNC mouthpieces in the same way that Rogan could be easily swayed to endorse Trump
I think part of it starts with the need for self-help (also therapy), which is always individual focused. Having just finished reading Naomi Klein's Doppelganger, it's clear to me that a more solidary/collective perspective is increasingly harder to foster.
I don't know if you've ever come across the work of Rhyd Wildermuth but I think you guys could have a really interesting discussion.
We do need a liberal Joe Rogan. In fact, we need about 50 of them.